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I changed the impeller on a 3 hp 1952-54 (JW-1) Johnson. As I took it apart, the lower unit fell on the floor. Now, the driveshaft does not engage the propeller. It is pushed in all the way. Is there a key or some other magic that makes the propeller turn?
Here is a diagram. http://www.marineengine.com/parts/johnson-evinrude-parts.php?year=1957&…
- Update- I fixed the link.
Link to diagram is dead. Not sure what "youtu.be" is but not youtube!
My bad.... Try this: http://www.marineengine.com/parts/johnson-evinrude-parts.php?year=1957&…
Here is the scenario I have, and I apologize in advance if this is not the correct place or format for my questions but I am new to forums like this. I have a son who loves fishing and we have been shore fishing the last few years but he is getting old enough that he wants to get out on the lakes. Good news is we live in Minnesota so plenty of lakes, bad news is I have never been around boats much. We got a 14'boat/trailer from someone and a evinrude 3hp lightwin motor. Good start they said it runs fine. We took it out a coupled times and it ran ok. By ok I mean full throttle was still very slow, but I thought eh it's a 3hp, I had to keep the throttle 3/4 to full for it to run. Then it started to die, right away. I noticed a few times it revved way up for about 3 seconds, probably about where it should. But it almost left us stranded in the lake and I would like us to fix it up together but I am new to 2 cycle motors. So far I changed plugs and emptied the gas completely to start fresh. Put it tank and it ran the same as before. Any guidance/direction would be appreciated. From reading this site sounds like a carb kit is a good start. Any suggestions?
Motor is Evinrude 3hp lightwin model 3602e.
I would love to be able to help teach my boy about boat motors and this one seems like a good starter project.
Take a good look at the ignition. All and I mean ALL 3 HP motors that old need new coils, and might as well change the points and condencer while you are at it. You cannot tell whether nor not those parts are bad by looking at them.
Check out my 3 and also 5.5 hp ignition tune-up pages.
I would do a full tune-up like I did before I turn my son loose with it.
Where do I find your tune up?
I just bought a Johnson 3 H.P. and am fixing it up. I have a fair amount of experience with outboards and 2 cycle engines. Your post was submitted last July but I just joined. If I can be of any help let me know. My Johnson 3 is apart now waiting for replacement parts. It's actually an enjoyable and easy engine to work on - it was designed to be. In case you don't know the Johnson and Evinrude are the same basic engine.
So I got all the parts for the ignition system from amazon thanks to this site. It was super easy. I followed the ignition tune up to the point of timing using a common ohm meter and that's where I am lost. I know nothing about electrical so the terminology like open closed infinite etc. Is confusing me.
What tool do I need to test it? Where do I attach both leads? The tester the guy at the auto parts store sold me only has one clip so I think it's the wrong meter? How do I tell which is number one or two?
Picture a simple circuit where you have a battery and light bulb. When you have a wire from the battery to the bulb, and then from the bulb back to the battery, you have a closed circuit. Electricity flows in a unbroken path once it goes out one side of the battery and into the other side. If you were to disconnect one of the wires, you would open the circuit, just as a common light switch opens and closes a circuit to the light bulb. Water valves work similar.... you open or close them.
What you are testing for is to be sure the breaker points close at the precise time that the timing marks on the flywheel are correctly aligned with the timing mark on the stator base.
If you take your ohm meter and touch the two probes together, your ohm meter will show 0 or closed circuit. If the probes do not touch each other, the reading will be infinity or open circuit. Some ohm meters have a setting where the meter will buzz then the circuit is closed. This is called a continuity test.
An ohm meter can be used to test whether a circuit is open or closed. Let's say we want to test a common household light bulb. If you put one lead of an ohm meter on the base of the lightbulb, and the other at the center connector, the ohm meter will check to see if electricity can flow through the lightbulb filament. If the filament is broken, the circuit is open as indicated by an infinite resistance (electricity does not flow through the air at low voltage) therefore the circuit is open and the lightbulb is burnt out. If you get a reading on the ohm meter that is 0 or nearly 0, then electricity is flowing through the filament and the lightbulb should be good. The ohmmeter does not send out enough electricity to light up the bulb, but is will check continuity, or wether the circuit is open or closed.
Here is a youtube video on the subject.
Take a close look at my 5.5 HP Ignition Page where I do a better job explaining how to test the timing. It is a different motor, but the ignition system is exactly the same the same. I usually encourage people to read both 3.5 and 5.5 HP.
Your test leads on your ohm will not fit under the flywheel to test the timing so you will need to connect one short piece of wire to your breaker point. Test wires with alligator clips are cheap and handy. You can get them from the local hardware store, or Amazon. Clip one end of the test wire to the screw terminal on the breaker point, where you would normally attach the coil and condenser wires as shown in the 5.5. Feed the other end of the test wire down through a hole in the stator base.
Now you can test whether your points are open or closed by connecting one lead of your ohm meter to the test lead, and the other to ground. By ground, I mean any bare metal or mounting screw on the motor. The motor itself is the other test lead.
Now you are ready to turn the flywheel and see if the circuit closes when the timing marks are lined up correctly as shown in the procedure.
You will need to repeat this procedure to adjust the timing on the other breaker points for the other cylinder.
I hope this helps. Tom
Wow, that was super useful. I followed those instructions and was able to complete the ignition system tune up. I put it in a bucket and ran it. It ran much better but still wouldn't Rev up very high, and gray blue smoke no matter how I adjusted the carb. It runs better as I turn the adjustment knob to the right but it bottoms out before it runs ok.
I thought I could skip the carb kit because from what I could see from the gasket sticking out, it looked new. However, I guess I will do the carb kit tomorrow.
Thanks for all the help it's been frustrating, but fun/educating.
Just spent the last two days on the lake. This site is awesome and allowed me to fix afun little motor up. It putters around slow but steady now. Thanks millions for all the help. My boy was driving it around today, with a huge smile.
I am sure you have a great appreciation now that you know that motor so well. I hope you had your boy involved so that he could gain experience that will last a lifetime. It is amazing how many people fix up those 3.5 HP motors. I was looking at some statistics for this site. Just today 234 people visited the site and spent time reading about the 3.5 project. These visitors are from all around the world and in dozens of different languages. This is not including other motors. The 3.5 is our most popular project. Enjoy your motor and may it last for at least another 50 years. If you get a chance, post some pictures here. Pictures and comments like yours are my greatest reward. Tom
You don't have to time your engine. It was done for you when manufactured. Just make sure the points cam eccentric is correctly installed on the crankshaft and the points plate is installed properly. If you got all new parts, coils, condensers and points just install them and gap the points and replace the flywheel.
I fixed up a 3hp Evinrude this summer, meaning, new ignition parts, carb kit etc... Basically all from this website. We took it out fishing about a dozen times, and it ran pretty good. It will still sputter, like it short on fuel, in the mid range, but low speed and wide open have been running great. Now I have encountered a new problem. We have been taking it further from the boat launch and after about 15 minutes of running it will start surging/sputtering really bad. If I idle it down low it will get us back to the launch, but faster=worse running. I started tinkering with the adjustment, this motor only has the one, it I can't get that condition to go away. Of note is the fact that I just discovered with the adjustment needle seated completely, or all the way in, the motor still won't die. I am new to engines but shouldn't that cut of the gas and kill the motor? New plugs, gas, ignition coils, carb parts, fuel stabilizer, wires, points, etc. When I replaced the plugs they had some black, flakey, gunk on them but I have seen worse. It smokes some white/blue smoke when first starting it, but nothing fierce. My boy and me have found some crappie holes on the other side of the lake, and its awesome to see his reaction when he reels them in a fast as the worm hits the water. However, I don't want to get stranded 20 minutes from the launch. The lake is about 500 acres, should it take a 3hp about 15-20 minutes to cover that much water? This is our first boat so I am not sure, I know a 3hp is really small and great for trolling.
Sorry about the rambling just hoping someone sees something relevant.
It is quite possible and not uncommon that you may need to take that carb off and clean it thoroughly again. The problem with old motors that are brought back to life is that small particle in the gas tank, and fuel delivery tends to vibrate loose and clog up the carburetor passageways. This is to be expected. Even though you did your best to clean everything, there is nothing like vibrating fuel to loosen things up over time. I had to clean a carburetor two or three times before I felt the motor was fully restored. This is all good and normal. If you are sputtering in a high, mid, or low range, this can mean that a passageway in the carb is clogged. Also, the adjustment needle, once you have it adjusted, leave it alone. It is not used for stopping the motor. You stop the motor by moving the throttle lever to the stop position which closes the butterfly valve in the carb. You won't need a new carb kit to clean the carb a second or third time in the same season.
Replaced impeller and gear case oil, rebuilt the recoil starter, carburetor, and ignition and cleaned the tank with paint thinner, on my 1966 JW21, and it ran great with a full tank of gas. SEcond or third time out trolling, it would sputter and die. After it sat a few minutes, would start and run for a short period of time, then sputter and die. Got back to the ramp by manipulating the choke to keep it running, which produced lots of smoke. Sound familiar?
Turns out the fuel filter is a cone shaped sintered metal unit mounted upright inside the tank at the outlet. When the tank was full, enough of the filter was immersed to allow sufficient fuel flow, but as fuel level dropped, fuel flow wasn't sufficient. I couldn't get the fuel filter to screw out to clean it. Might have been able to clean in place by filling tank or reverse flushing with some noxious solvent, or get it out by applying heat and/or Kroil, but lost patience and drilled it out and put inline filter in the line between tank outlet and carb. Now my JW runs awesome! Can get my Grumman Sport Boat down to extremely slow trolling speed. Runs better every time out.
I SUGGEST ADDING R&R OF THE IN TANK FUEL FILTER TO MUST DO LIST FOR REVIVAL OF THIS MODEL OF JOHNNYRUDES.
I just bought a Johnson 3HP and the sintered bronze fuel filter was beyond cleaning. I tried lacquer thinner and even Muriatic acid. Fuel would only flow for the first 1/2 of the tank. I took the filter out and cut off the sinterd bronze protion of the brass fitting. I'm waiting for a VW gas tank filter from eBay to solder the brass screen onto the fitting for the Johnson. You can buy a new OEM style filter for about $40.00 but I wasn't going to pay that. I cleaned my gas tank by dropping in about 750 BBs and about eight ounces of lacquer thinner. I bought some rubber plugs at the harware store to plug the fuel filler hole and carburetor fuel feed hole. I shook the living daylights out of the tank twice and then rinsed it with Formula 409 and water. Tank's clean.
Glat to hear you got it working with your retrofit. I did some searching. The Evinrude part number for that filter is 0594034. I could not find it on Amazon, but I did find some listed on eBay.
When all else fails, try eBay. I buy a lot of parts there and plan to sign up as an eBay affiliate, much like I am on amazon.com.
Enjoy your great little motor.
not sure if this is the correct place
but i have a 1963 evinrude lightwin that was given to me by my scout group
it has good spark but it wont run i took of the head and found that the compression is really bad probably need to replace piston rings probably the pistons and redo the cylinder walls
the crank case bearings seem to be worn out as well
all this was probably caused by bad cooling so the lower unit probably needs a rebuild as well
i need to do a full teardown to look for any further damage but my question is if anyone has experience rebuilding this engine or knows if it is worth it to do a complete rebuild
and where to find parts i looked all over the internet for replacement pistons and rings but cannot find them any help would be apriciated
What does the compression read on your tester? Should be 70-80 psi.
Parts are hard to find. You may be better off looking for a parts motor on e-bay. Sometimes they have them for a lot less money than you would spend on parts.
i dont have a compression tester but i removed the exhaust cover plate and turned the flywheel and could hear hissing comming from the pistons when they go up for compression and at least one of the pistons looks a bit damaged
now im tearing apart the block to get a detailed look at the parts and might dingle ball hone the cylinders if they need it
but i cant find any pistons for it not new and not second hand rings i asume can be just bought with the right mesurements
okey i took the entire engine block apart and the cylinders have some light scoring in the bottom end so now i have to figure out if i can just hone fix that or have to overbore the block
and both pistons are scored to hell
also i need a couple of small parts like gaskets and such and some waterpump parts but it looks a lot better then i thought it would
so now it seems i need 2 new pistons and rings a full gasket set and a water pump impeller housing ( i broke one of the bolt holes off due to bad corosion )
but now im stuck with the thing that there are no bearings in the block it looks like some sort of bearing is cast into the block it doesnt seem to be worn out though
any further tips and links to new pistons are very welcome
1963 Evinrude 3hp 3303s marine engine.com oversize rings pistons and more
i allready looked at that site
oversize rings are still available but the pistons both original and oversize are not made anymore
plus i took the block to a shop and it looks like they have to be overbored a litle
right now im waiting on what its going to cost to fabricate new pistons and have the block done if its not over 200 ill pull the trigger on it and do a full rebuild cause i really like this engine and taking risks on buying second hand blocks and pistons can end up more expensive if they turn out to be bad
if anyone knows a place that can fabricate pistons that would be helpfull i allready contacted a few places but they say i have to contact a dealer but the only evinrude dealer in my country doesnt have anything for my motor
i did some more digging and found a block with all the rotating assambly in it in good condition the shop that has it is even getting me a fresh compression reading and claims its a good engine and they said it was running before it was disassembled
the piston fabricator came back with a cost estimate of 250 just for the pistons for the old block i have now and with all the other parts its gonna put the total at 350 thats what this engine is worth if i would sell it
so in the end its a bummer that i cant use the original block but at least i get a cheap outboard to use on my boat in the summer
does the 57 evinrude lightwinn have other gears besides forward
No, You spin the entire motor around if you want to go in reverse. These were called "dock busters" because there is no neutral or reverse. In actual use, this is not a problem.
thank you ttravis very cool i was woundering why the motor could do a full 360
where does the water come out on my evinrude 3hp i have seen new outboards with a solid stream out the side but nothing on mine there is a passage on the back of the shaft with a small amount of water is it supposed to be like that or is there somewhere a real strong stream comes out
There are a couple small hones that letts water and exhaust out of the lower unit. There is not a whole lot of water that comes out. Mine is about the same amount as a coffee maker makes coffee.
is that square hole with the stud on the middle where the water is supposed to come out
I had the same problem with my 3 HP project motor. I had to unclog all the passageways.
alright do i have to remove the motor and is the where the water is supposed to come out and did you just take the head off
can i use rtv gasket maker for a temporary head gasket and the mating surface for the motor to the lower unit
I would recommend getting a proper head gasket. RTV may not be strong enough to withstand the pressure and heat, plus it could get into the water jackets and cause a problem. I don't know where you are located, but for me, head gaskets are not expensive. I know some people in the world have a hard time getting parts and have to improvise more.
alright do i have to remove the motor and is the where the water is supposed to come out and did you just take the head off
I took off the powerhead and traced the complete path of the water from the impeller input to where it dumps out with the exhaust in the lower unit. I used an air hose and several fine wires and drill bits to get everything cleared out. I believe I wrote about this in either my 3.0 or 5.5 projects. Some of it was blind, so I used the air hose to blow air in and see where it comes out. It took a while. Many of the passageways are small and easily clogged, killing many motors.
hey guys new problem lol took the head off and cleaned all the water passages very gummed up but after reinstalling the head (using the original gasket) and now the motor will not start now note that it sputtered to life for a few seconds after putting carb clean in the combustion chamber but after that nothing.... what do you guys think
Float needle stuck? You probably had the power head upside down which jammed the needle past it’s normal position.
In your tune up instructions for 3hp Lightwin (which are great, btw) is what you call cylinder 1 the upper or lower cylinder?
Cylinder 1 is the upper cylinder.
i just tuned up an early 50’s Johnson; carb, ignition, impeller, the works. It has good spark but is immediately flooding, to the point where gas drips from the carburetor/air silencer connection. When I rebuilt the carb, I lost the little spring that holds the float needle to the float. Since some of these carburetors don’t have the spring, I put it back together without it. It flooded. So, l took the float bowl off and installed a spring I found among my old parts (I have four 3 hp Evinrude/Johnson’s). It is still flooding.
I backed off the high speed needle 1&1/2 turns and the low speed needle 3/4 turn.
I think the problem is either with the needle and seat, or the adjustment of the float.
I would try adjusting the float so it is slightly downward so it will shut off the flow of fuel sooner.
If that doesn't work, then I would install a new needle, clip, and seat. Make sure you replace all three from the same set. Mixing parts between sets can result in a mismatched fit and not work as well. You probably do not need a new carb kit if you just got one.
If I had your model number, I would provide a link. This is probably it 18-7038 Sierra Carburetor Needle and Seat
I don't think the Jets would cause the carb to flood the way you described.
Sounds like you are almost there. Don't give up.
Excellent advice. I disassembled the float assembly, adjusted the float, and reassembled everything. Now it runs beautifully. Third time was a charm. Thanks.
I am new to this site and I thank you for all this great info. I am working on a Johnson CD-11. I am trying to convert it to operate with a single hose fuel tank. I have mounted a Mikuni fuel pump and used the 7/16 plug method to get a pulse. I am using clear fuel line and I am seeing that the pulse line is gradually filling with fuel as the motor runs. After about 5 min. the fuel pump quits working. I can drain the fuel from the pulse line and it will run again until more fuel gets into the pulse line. I considered that the fuel was coming from a leaking fuel pump diaphragm, but it seems to be coming out of the motor. Has anyone else had this problem?
What do you mean by 7/16 plug method?
Let me rephrase that. I used a vacuum cap, which I believe was 7/16", it fit snug, to plug one of the check valve holes after removing the check valves. I think I followed the instructions correctly.
I don't know what would cause that. I never used clear fuel lines. I don't see how the pulse line could fill up with fuel unless maybe your fuel pump is bad.
I know this is not a solution, but I have done this procedure myself and I know that many others have since I published this procedure over ten years ago. Eventually, after several years of fun, my 5.5 motor gave out because the upper crankshaft seal went bad and I have not found a replacement. I plan to get in some good garage time this winter and take another crack at it.
Thanks for the input. I will try repairing or replacing the fuel pump. I don't own a two hose pressure tank, so I am highly motivated to make this work. With the pulse line routed this way, I may be able to better see where the fuel is coming from.